State of the M-151 hobby

**Sponsor**

by **rickf** » December 30th, 2017, 12:49 pm

I am curious what the general consensus of opinion is on where the M-151 hobby is headed. These were at one time a good vehicle to buy and restore due to the availability of cheap quality parts. Not so anymore, most of what is needed for mechanical repair is Chinese garbage and what very little NOS stuff is left is priced in the stratosphere. 100.00 for a set of spark plugs, 200.00 plus for a ignition coil if you can even find them. To me at least the vehicle is not worth it because those prices mean to me that you cannot afford to continue to drive the vehicle. you may never find that next set of plugs or you may have to carry 6 Chinese ignition coils with you and the tools to change them on the road. Driveshaft u-joints, anybody see them anywhere? They are getting low in supply and I have not seen them even in Chinese.

by **Fil Bonica** » December 30th, 2017, 1:32 pm

You are painting an entirely bleak picture.
Careful searching will get you what you need.
Wouldnt give up yet.
Screw the Chinese junk!

FilBonica

by **rickf** » December 30th, 2017, 2:37 pm

This is not about me really, It is about the entire 151 community. I am one of those in the group who is on a very tight budget. disability and fixed income equates to purchase food and household supplies first and toy stuff second. Well, living in NJ leaves nothing left for the toys. In my case I am lucky to have quite a few spares so I am good for a little while. This thread is really what everyone thinks about where it is going. I know the stuff can be found, for a price. It is like the old question " can you fix it?" I can fix anything with enough money. But is it worth it. Will a M-151 ever reach the monetary status of the MB or GPW or will it remain just a neat vehicle that brings back memories to a shrinking group of guys who grew up with it?

by **kmam** » December 30th, 2017, 3:09 pm

Interesting topic. Having just restored one I feel the pain of prices and know the difficulty of getting some parts, e.g. universal joints, and the cost of sourcing from overseas in my case. I think I would not have embarked on the project if I had known this before I started but am pleased I did.

Hopefully there will always be interest as eventually I would like to recover my investment...

by **Horst** » December 30th, 2017, 4:18 pm

I have a feeling that in general things have changed significantly. Years back, I would see ex-military vehicles in the area I live (Munich) quite frequently, either former German or US Army stuff or jeeps or anything olive drab in general. Not anymore. Nothing. Yes, some Mercedes G-Wagons and a few Unimogs as they are sold off presently. But nothing old. I don't know why. These jeeps or 151s must be around somewhere but people are no longer driving them around. Not sure if that is an age thing and folks who had them just got too old driving them or people don't want to be seen with anything military.
Not that I drive around mine every day, I am just not home most of the time and that spare driving time is somehow divided between the different toys I have but I put at least 1.000 miles on the 151 this year.

by **Mark** » December 30th, 2017, 5:43 pm

Hmmm, I plan on living to a hundred, doesn't sound like the mutt will be around.

by **199th mp** » December 30th, 2017, 7:06 pm

i sold mine for several reasons, but i miss it all the time. i still find myself on the lookout for parts, and just recently Dave helped me out with a sponson plate for a friend of mine. the only time i get to drive one now is when i drive his A2 in the july 4th parade. the brother MP i sold it to is still having fun with it. he says it still runs fine. i sent him a lot of spare parts when he bought it.

by **Fil Bonica** » December 30th, 2017, 9:35 pm

As long as i am able I will continue to have an A2
Just too much fun.
There is a lot of Chinese junk out there-but as. I said before there is also a lot of good stuff.

Fil Bonica

by **m3a1** » December 30th, 2017, 10:37 pm

You aren't seeing the military Liberty trucks or White touring cars around any more, either. I believe this is the nature of the hobby.

Our 151s aren't the International or Studebaker or GMC trucks of WWII where they were plucking pieces out of the parts bins extant and creating something not entirely "new"... nor are they the Jeeps which went on to have a huge following in civilian hands.

If one were to sit down and take a hard look at what the military had in WWII, those military vehicles I just mentioned are actually in the very small minority and so, it is the same with our M151s which were a purpose-built and highly specialized truck. They are trucks which, as we all know, have to this day had a huge following in other countries owing to Uncle Sam's generosity. So, we compete not only against our fellows but other governments as well. Such is the nature of the beast.

We aren't yet at the crossroads where such things as park plugs or coils are going to be the deciding factor. We can see how it might come to pass where "all-original" is no longer possible, but we aren't there yet. Not even close. I'm betting someone is going to figure out a solution to these problems sooner or later and probably for the better.

But I would like to add this. Like the time when MBs and GPWs were being sold off after WWII, this is now the time to get yourself a HMMWV, or a M1098 (which will probably be my next truck) The price will never be cheaper and if cared for, the value will never go down. You can't say that about a new civilian truck. In fact, your grandson, or great grandson will likely thank you for making the investment. There are a whole raft of newer MVs out there looking for a good home and that is what we do in this hobby.

If you think you can't justify the expense, consider what happens to your money when you buy a new pickup truck. $30-40-50 THOUSAND dollars and what will it be worth in four years....or eight years?!! Compare that to a carefully chosen MV straight from the government. It's value will NOT go down unless you mistreat it. So, perhaps it is time to baby your baby M151 and get it a new brother.

It's the circle of life, man. Hakuna matata.

by **Hambone** » December 31st, 2017, 12:04 am

Well, I'm in too deep to bail out now, I would agree with Fil, the parts are still out there if you just look around, I've been able to find most anything I needed in the last 8 years. I would be more worried about fuel tanks and A1 fuel pumps(if you want to stay original), as far as the coils, I figure anyone who owns a Korean or Vietnam 24v MV is facing the same situation. That make me feel like someone with eventually repro a descent coil, I hear that they are already out there. I pick up every good deal I find on parts and probably have more than I will ever need, Blake still has tons of NOS parts and mega tons of t/o parts. As far as the jeep, we all know it was the longest serving jeep in the military, it has the best off road capability and ride compared to other 1/4 tons. I know Rick likes the CJ's but they can't follow the 151's. :mrgreen:

I'm a lifer, long live the M151. :wink:

by **CentraSpike75** » December 31st, 2017, 10:32 am

Great topic!
I am 42. I have wanted a M151 since I was 15. I finally got one this year. I have been able to find the parts I need plus extra but the parts are getting more expensive. I have watched MV and parts prices for over 20 years. I am very happy to have my 151 and this site and its members are an amazing resource.
I think the larger issue is with the MV hobby. Most of the people I meet in the hobby are Baby Boomers and up in age. There seems to be an age gap. I think there are several factors that contribute to this: young people just want reliable transportation and do not have the time or disposable income, a very small percentage of the overall population has served in the military or has military interests, middle age guys don't even have MVs on their radar and many are in the same position as Rick, on a fixed income in a increasingly expensive hobby.
I agree that the current lot of HMMWVs can be found at great prices (Still a significant investment) and will appreciate.
I look at the prices of CJ5s and 7s now and remember when I was buying decent ones for 1-2K and are now outrageous.
My hope is that we can get younger people in the hobby and in the case of the 151 people will begin to appreciate the forward thinking, unique design and history of the vehicle.
Also I have seen people like Guy get into the hobby and then begin to turn out needed parts to keep the Mutts moving down the road.
Thank everyone on the forum for all of the great stories, info and sense of community.
Happy New Year,
Andy

by **rickf** » December 31st, 2017, 10:44 am

Ok, several people have said the parts are still out there but let me ask this, where are you getting the 2245 spark plugs? Or their equivalents? Production has stopped on all brands of them from what I can gather. The only other engines to use that style of plug that I know is the aircraft industry and ANYTHING in the aircraft industry is BIG bucks if you can find the right one. I think Horst can back me up on that one. I have not checked but a spark plug for a Continental or Lycoming aircraft engine is probably 40-50 bucks each.

M3a1 mention the HMMWVs. well, yes, they can be bought at auction cheap. By cheap I mean in the 4-6 grand range for one that runs and is mostly complete. The BIG problem is that it comes with an off road only title. Now, I know that right away a ton of people are going to say "but you can get a title through......................." .. Yes, you can, I know someone who has done it. And the problem he is having is that it does not have a legitimate 17 digit serial number which is required of all vehicles after a certain date. That date is much earlier than the first HMMWV. Now, assuming you do get your title and you do get it on the road with tags and you have an accident and someone is killed, The lawyers are going to be ALL OVER it and you are going to lose everything you own and ever will own. Is it worth the risk?
If you want to spend 20 grand at auction you can get a year 201 and later HMMWV that will come with a fully legal transferable title for driving on the road. Be aware that working on one of those things is a freaking nightmare!

by **rickf** » December 31st, 2017, 10:44 am

Ok, several people have said the parts are still out there but let me ask this, where are you getting the 2245 spark plugs? Or their equivalents? Production has stopped on all brands of them from what I can gather. The only other engines to use that style of plug that I know is the aircraft industry and ANYTHING in the aircraft industry is BIG bucks if you can find the right one. I think Horst can back me up on that one. I have not checked but a spark plug for a Continental or Lycoming aircraft engine is probably 40-50 bucks each.

M3a1 mention the HMMWVs. well, yes, they can be bought at auction cheap. By cheap I mean in the 4-6 grand range for one that runs and is mostly complete. The BIG problem is that it comes with an off road only title. Now, I know that right away a ton of people are going to say "but you can get a title through......................." .. Yes, you can, I know someone who has done it. And the problem he is having is that it does not have a legitimate 17 digit serial number which is required of all vehicles after a certain date. That date is much earlier than the first HMMWV. Now, assuming you do get your title and you do get it on the road with tags and you have an accident and someone is killed, The lawyers are going to be ALL OVER it and you are going to lose everything you own and ever will own. Is it worth the risk?
If you want to spend 20 grand at auction you can get a year 201 and later HMMWV that will come with a fully legal transferable title for driving on the road. Be aware that working on one of those things is a freaking nightmare!

by **Hambone** » December 31st, 2017, 11:28 am

Sparks plugs should last for thousands of miles, I don't think I will wear out a set, so if you spend $60-80 on a set you should be good for many years. I bought one of these to clean up the carbon fouled ones, best $15 you can spend. https://www.harborfreight.com/pneumatic ... 32860.html

by **rickf** » December 31st, 2017, 12:15 pm

They are what we used on aircraft plugs but you have to be very careful of the media that is used because if you abrade the porcelain it will carbon foul very quickly after that and the plugs will be junk.

With that said I want to keep this thread to the opinions on the hobby and possibly leads to known reliable suppliers of NOS parts. When I say reliable I mean that the NOS parts have been proven to be just that, NOS and not Chinese. Tools or repair stuff can be linked to a new thread in the appropriate section.