Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

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cactus magnet
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Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by cactus magnet » July 13th, 2017, 5:12 pm

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After sitting in the garage for a couple of years, I'm finally starting to work on my (somewhat hacked) MUTT.

I have three simple timing questions:
1. I would expect that the timing pointer would extend at a right angle over the pulley. Mine doesn't--the bottom edge of the timing pointer is about 15-20 degrees off from perpendicular (it may not be quite obvious in the photo). Can someone confirm whether that is normal, or whether my pointer is bent?

2. I noticed that the distributor shaft is flipped 180 degrees from what is implied in the manual--when the timing mark is near the timing pointer, the rotor points toward the passenger side/rear spark wire position, not toward the normal #1 position--toward driver side/front. The spark plugs wires were rearranged by P/O to preserve the firing order (see photo). At some future point, I'll want to fix this. If I follow the directions to re-install the distributor (TM 9-2320-218-34-1 pp 3-69 to 3-30) that it will be obvious that the distributor was installed backwards? Or is there some other source of incorrect gear timing that could have caused this problem?

3. Anyone know at what RPM the centrifugal advance kicks in? My idle speed is high (900 - 1k), but I'd like to get the timing close before I start messing with the carb.

Thanks in Advance,
Glenn H.

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rickf
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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by rickf » July 13th, 2017, 5:41 pm

The timing pointer should stick straight out and if I remember correctly somebody said you can take the adapter shaft and rotate it 180 degrees on the distributor. I would have to look at the manual to verify that. You need to get your idle down to 650-700. It is a simple screw adjust on the linkage.
1964 M151A1
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone

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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by cactus magnet » July 13th, 2017, 7:17 pm

OK--thanks!

Fil Bonica
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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by Fil Bonica » July 13th, 2017, 8:14 pm

As rick said the distributor can be set two ways.
One is 180 degrees out.
Not good.
If you want , go back , pull distributor , remove inter mediate shaft set engine for number one cylinder firing position.
The oil pump shaft should be indexed parallel to the block.
Insert the intermediate shaft and distributor .
If all things are correct the rotor should be pointing towards 1'oclock not 7 oclock.
Anything other than that indcates tye oil pump may have been insalled incorrectly.
A Big problem to fix means removing engine to fix.
You can refer to the 34 series manual for reference.
They are available to view on this site.
Hope what i said makes sense.

Fil Bonica
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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by cactus magnet » July 13th, 2017, 10:58 pm

Thanks, Fil--I'll hope for just an easy flip of the distributor shaft...

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svramselaar
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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by svramselaar » July 14th, 2017, 3:29 am

hi

at only the distributor you can do it at two manners
pul the distributor out and take the little pin from the connector notch out and turn the notch half turn put the pin back
the other one take the ground plate out now you see the centrifugal weights pul the axle half up( maybe there is a lock ring at the top off the shaft ) and turn it half turn and put all back

george

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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by Horst » July 14th, 2017, 4:01 am

it has been a while since I build my motor. but I am almost certain that you cannot simply turn that intermediate shaft, the oil pump needs to be installed the right way.
Horst

1972 USMC M151A2 w/ROPS (ex Barstow) and M416
1962 M201 and trailer
1966 GTO,1982 E350 Skoolie, 1987 SJ413, 1987 911
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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by rickf » July 14th, 2017, 9:21 am

I am really curious about this. The pin that George talks about will, in theory work. But in reality it does not because it was drilled just a hair off center and the pin will not go back in the same hole once the gear is repositioned. I know because I have a dozen distributors that the gear was installed 180 degrees out on. There is a procedure in the -34 for installing a new gear, or "dog" as I call it, on the distributor. That procedure is outlined in the -34 right down to details on how to make a jig for positioning the dog in the exact right position on the shaft.
1964 M151A1
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone

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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by Fil Bonica » July 14th, 2017, 6:28 pm

Just went down to the parts cabinet and set up the distributor , intermediate shaft and a NOS oil pump.
The distributor and intermediate shaft will only go in one way.
The intermediate shaft and oil pump will go in both ways.
Therefore the distributor can be installed 180 degrees'out.
Correct placement of the oil pump is still critical and mst be done by opening the oil pan and resetting.
A bit of a job!
For what it's all worth!

Fil Bonica
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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by svramselaar » July 15th, 2017, 4:30 am

hi

Rickf
the cam where the notch is for the points can be turn a half turn at the advance weights

george

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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by muttguru » July 15th, 2017, 5:56 am

If you think the oil pump has been installed wrong.


Here's the detail from the TM on how the oil pump should be installed. You don't need to to remove the engine or anything like that to check if your oil pump was installed correctly. Just bring the #1 piston up to TDC (both valves closed) and then pull out the distributor, followed by the intermediate shaft. Then check to see if the notch in the oilpump drive faces forward and parallel with the camshaft. If it is, fine... if it isn't, then it's a big decision that you need to make.


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If everything is fine....make sure you re-install the intermediate shaft the correct way, otherwise your ignition wires will be 180 degrees out-of-sync at the distributor cap.

Ken
Kind regards....
Ken

Always wanted - Details and pictures of M416 Trailer data plates & M151 data plates & body-tags for my research. Thanks!

Contact address - - muttguru@aol.com

Note for 2023..... Ken..."Less Stress - More Exercise!"

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Re: Distributor/timing--issues from previous owner

Unread post by cactus magnet » July 15th, 2017, 1:44 pm

Thanks for all of the data--I'll check the alignment of the oil pump and decide where to go from there.

Glenn

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