Brake Problem
Moderators: rickf, raymond, Mr. Recovery
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- Sergeant Major
- Posts: 524
- Joined: June 6th, 2015, 7:39 am
- Location: Kuranda, Far North Queensland, Australia
Brake Problem
Seems I will never finish this project - ah well, at least I do not get bored, just broke...
The latest is that the top springs retaining stud on the drivers side front backing plate has sheared. Clearly I can fix that by buying a new backing plate but the cost when landed in Australia is prohibitive and I am wondering if anyone has ever repaired it. e.g. drill out the old, turn up a new one with thread passing through the plate and bolt it on? Or any other way?
The latest is that the top springs retaining stud on the drivers side front backing plate has sheared. Clearly I can fix that by buying a new backing plate but the cost when landed in Australia is prohibitive and I am wondering if anyone has ever repaired it. e.g. drill out the old, turn up a new one with thread passing through the plate and bolt it on? Or any other way?
Howard
Daimler Ferret Mk 1/2
AM General M151A2
Austin Champ
Daimler Ferret Mk 1/2
AM General M151A2
Austin Champ
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- Brigadier General
- Posts: 2506
- Joined: October 1st, 2010, 12:19 am
- Location: El Dorado, Arkansas
Re: Brake Problem
I would drill and tap it, use a grade 8 bolt, you could shape the head of the bolt with grinder if you want it to look original, or fix it with a welder.
Re: Brake Problem
Or you could use a grade 8 allen head bolt, That would be easier to get the spring tool over. But the big question here is how did it get broken off? It appears that it was sheared off from right to left by impact. Are the shoes riding on the support post correctly?
1964 M151A1
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone
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- Brigadier General
- Posts: 2506
- Joined: October 1st, 2010, 12:19 am
- Location: El Dorado, Arkansas
Re: Brake Problem
Maybe you could use some Kangaroo Glue , just a little humor, it should be an easy fix, shouldn't have to remove the backing plate.
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- Sergeant Major
- Posts: 524
- Joined: June 6th, 2015, 7:39 am
- Location: Kuranda, Far North Queensland, Australia
Re: Brake Problem
Trouble with Kangaroo glue is the brakes will keep jumping...
Thanks for the ideas. I reckon the drill and tap is the solution. Why did it happen? Looking at the broken part it seems, from the discolouration, it may have been partly broken for some time. I don't know why it gave out now but sadly when it broke and the spring flew back one of them chipped a little off the brake cylinder I think it will not be an immediate problem but it should be replaced as it is possibly weakened.
Thanks for the ideas. I reckon the drill and tap is the solution. Why did it happen? Looking at the broken part it seems, from the discolouration, it may have been partly broken for some time. I don't know why it gave out now but sadly when it broke and the spring flew back one of them chipped a little off the brake cylinder I think it will not be an immediate problem but it should be replaced as it is possibly weakened.
Howard
Daimler Ferret Mk 1/2
AM General M151A2
Austin Champ
Daimler Ferret Mk 1/2
AM General M151A2
Austin Champ
Re: Brake Problem
If all it chipped was the lip that the seal hangs on then don't worry about it as long as the seal stays on there. That is not a stress area and will never break from normal use. I do see a lot of fluid in there though.
1964 M151A1
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone
-
- Brigadier General
- Posts: 2506
- Joined: October 1st, 2010, 12:19 am
- Location: El Dorado, Arkansas
Re: Brake Problem
Are you rebuilding the brakes? your shoes look good unless they are oil soaked, if the cyls are leaking, NAPA sells rebuild kit for $7 and cyls for $34, brakes are kinda important. Do you have a NAPA down under?
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- Sergeant Major
- Posts: 524
- Joined: June 6th, 2015, 7:39 am
- Location: Kuranda, Far North Queensland, Australia
Re: Brake Problem
I put all new brake shoes/linings in when I did the restoration, plus cylinders and lines. I took the damaged cylinder down to an old style brake place today and they will re-sleeve it so that damaged part is not an issue. The problem I have, apart from the broken stud, is that the cylinder leaked fluid all over the brake linings on that wheel.
Howard
Daimler Ferret Mk 1/2
AM General M151A2
Austin Champ
Daimler Ferret Mk 1/2
AM General M151A2
Austin Champ
Re: Brake Problem
If it was DOT 3 fluid you might be able to get by with several cleanings of brake cleaner and moderate heating from a torch to draw out residual fluid. MODERATE heating being the key words here, you are not heating metal.If it was a silicone brake fluid they are trashed and will need to be replaced.
I keep coming back to what did the damage? A spring will not break a cylinder to the point of needing a sleeve. So whatever broke the pin also broke the cylinder. I am wondering if maybe the brake shoe was not in the piston pin for the wheel cylinder and somehow the shoes grabbed and spun around and the frame of the shoe caught the cylinder and the pin. This would have to have been in reverse if this is the drivers side (left) and the pin did break towards the rear as it looks.
I keep coming back to what did the damage? A spring will not break a cylinder to the point of needing a sleeve. So whatever broke the pin also broke the cylinder. I am wondering if maybe the brake shoe was not in the piston pin for the wheel cylinder and somehow the shoes grabbed and spun around and the frame of the shoe caught the cylinder and the pin. This would have to have been in reverse if this is the drivers side (left) and the pin did break towards the rear as it looks.
1964 M151A1
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone
-
- Sergeant Major
- Posts: 524
- Joined: June 6th, 2015, 7:39 am
- Location: Kuranda, Far North Queensland, Australia
Re: Brake Problem
Yes, it did happen in reverse I heard a clunk and then the brakes locked plus the pedal went to the floor. All symptomatic of the shoe coming adrift allowing the piston to travel further than it should. I've just been having a closer look and it seems to me that the trailing shoe is not sitting properly at the top - it is pressing against the backing plate and being held too far out on the post. i will take a photo later but I am wondering if the backing plate may be slightly bent - to the naked eye it looks true but that does not necessarily mean much.
Howard
Daimler Ferret Mk 1/2
AM General M151A2
Austin Champ
Daimler Ferret Mk 1/2
AM General M151A2
Austin Champ
-
- Sergeant Major
- Posts: 524
- Joined: June 6th, 2015, 7:39 am
- Location: Kuranda, Far North Queensland, Australia
Re: Brake Problem
Howard
Daimler Ferret Mk 1/2
AM General M151A2
Austin Champ
Daimler Ferret Mk 1/2
AM General M151A2
Austin Champ
Re: Brake Problem
Do you have the proper shoe hold down springs? One that is pulling the shoe in too tight would cause that to happen. You need to solve the problem before attempting the repair or you will be doing it again.......................and again. You could also have a bent shoe, I have seen that many times right out of the box. Take at least four shoes off and compare them closely lying flat on their sides on a flat surface to be sure it is not a bent shoe.
Looking at a close up of that picture it looks like the end tab of the shoe may be bent out. Hard to tell when in place like that without another shoe for reference.
Looking at a close up of that picture it looks like the end tab of the shoe may be bent out. Hard to tell when in place like that without another shoe for reference.
1964 M151A1
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone
Re: Brake Problem
Make your visual reference point the plate that the brake pad attaches to. You can see that the piece is bent as it is way off center.
Re: Brake Problem
Way back when................... When brake shoes were rebuilt and relined by quality companies they had dies for all of the different styles of shoes and after the old lining was stripped off that shoe would go int the die and stamp, it is all straight and to spec again. Not anymore, they get the shoes in and they strip off the old material, clean the metal and paint it and throw on new linings and out the door. The fit is your problem. One of the guys that worked for me had worked at a brake rebuild shop for 40 years and all I had to do was pull a drum off and he would look at it and tell me the part number! I never had to have the parts store do a lookup. And all those scares about asbestos, his lungs were perfect and he retired from there when they were still using asbestos brakes on everything. He did have a heart attack in the shop but that was clogged arteries and not from asbestos.
1964 M151A1
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone
1984 M1008
1967 M416
04/1952 M100
12/1952 M100- Departed
AN/TSQ-114A Trailblazer- Gone
Re: Brake Problem
Sorry to hear that about your friend Rick but some docs have stated that exposure to asbestos does significantly increase your chances of stroke and heart disease for some time now.
Course one year they tell you a glass a wine each night is good for you and the next year they say it's not. Who truly knows?
Course one year they tell you a glass a wine each night is good for you and the next year they say it's not. Who truly knows?
1960 M151 Run #1
"There is one nut on a M151 that is very difficult to remove....." - K8icu
"She ain't a Cadillac and she ain't a Rolls, But there ain't nothin' wrong with the radio" - Aaron Tippin
"There is one nut on a M151 that is very difficult to remove....." - K8icu
"She ain't a Cadillac and she ain't a Rolls, But there ain't nothin' wrong with the radio" - Aaron Tippin